Adding "Skill based matchmaking" to other gamemodes

Suggestions
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Idea:

I already have a slight problem with the way this function works on the bridge, that being that it is based on wins, so I commonly run into cheaters and the sweatiest children on the planet. That being said, it’s a great idea, I just think it needs a few tweaks, as well the addition of said function to other gamemodes, such as TW, SW, CTF, and others.

My first and not terribly well thought out idea is to literally just transfer the current system of skill-based matchmaking to other gamemodes, but this has a few obvious flaws, some of which I already mentioned. My next idea, and probably the most reasonable one, is to add level-based matchmaking, for example in Treasure Wars, you could make it so that, on average, me (a level 44) would get paired with people ranging from level 40-50, and then 50-60, and so on. This would also help to flush out cheaters, especially in the lower levels. For example, if someone is a level 5 and a level 3 is in the lobby with a 20+ winstreak, the chances of them being a hacker or an alt account are high, meaning more cheaters could be found and reported. Of course there are other contingencies, which include having a level 60 and a level 30 queue together in a party. In this scenario, there are three reasonable solutions. One is that you put level-based matchmaking in it’s own “gamemode” category, therefore you can still play what we know as Treasure Wars right now, while being able to play with friends of different levels. The second option is to have skill-based matchmaking based on the party leader’s skill level, allowing you to choose the general difficulty of the players you go up against. This again has many flaws, as you could, theoretically, get 3 prestige 5’s in a party with one level 3, and just queue extremely low level players to quickly level up. That is why I think the third option is the best overall, and should be more heavily considered than the previous options, although I think all solutions have some amount of merit. The third solution is to take the mean average of all the players levels in the party, and expand the level matchmaking, width, so instead of levels 50-60 being together, with this, it would be more like 40-60 or 35-60.

This is just treasure wars however. I’m open to suggestions on how I can make this idea better and anything else you have to say that I might’ve overlooked. Thanks!

Flaws:

I understand that my ideas are not perfect. Because of this, I have made a list of flaws that I have not found solutions to as of yet. If you have solutions for these flaws, please let me know so this idea can be even better.

The list is as follows:

  • No level based matchmaking for prestige players
  • There is no way to tell if someone is a better level compared to how much experience they’ve gained
  • If it was another “gamemode” it would most likely never be used, meaning it would have to be implemented into the base game, which might drive higher level players away as well as lower level players

This list will increase and decrease as time progresses and these issues are fixed. Thank you for reading!

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It is not a great idea. There are so many problems with sbmm, but I’ve repeatedly said all that stuff in another post so lemme just copy that over.

there are many things that contribute to platform disparity.

  • One of them, the most notable for pvp, is cps. Getting high cps on mobile is hard, getting high cps on controller is harder, but on keyboard and mouse all u gotta do is butterfly for like 20cps free.
  • Another disparity is the ease of projectile combos, on mobile (the good, pvpable controls (the old ones)) u gotta press and hold to snowball/bow without being able to turn and aim so snowball combos are basically impossible, meanwhile u just gotta press a button on kbm (keyboard and mouse) and controller. This makes it very hard to deal with people who projectile combo when you’re mobile, because you can’t just do it back. (this also applies to pearls and spellbooks, which is very annoying.)
  • A third disparity is the inability to toggle perspective to see if they’re behind you, which is a big deal when being chased.
  • A fourth disparity is that mobile players (on the old controls which most mobile pvpers use) can’t sprint midair so if ur looting a chest and get hit even if u exit the inventory immediately if the person can keep u in the air u can’t escape without placing blocks and hoping they mess up. Obviously this isn’t a problem on controller or kbm. This also limits you to only one kind of jump reset, so fighting people with less ping than u is very hard because you can’t unsprint midair and then resprint for spacing.
  • A fifth disparity is jump bridging. In games like skywars and treasure wars where you gotta bridge to mid being able to jump bridge is important. However, the only platform without a “use” button is mobile (again, I’m referring only to the old controls because the new controls suck for pvp so there’s no real point using them) meaning we can’t bridge as fast or as easily.

All in all, there are tons of platform disparities that make ensuring that mobile players queue with mobile players, controller players queue with controller players, and kbm players queue with kbm players an absolute necessity to ensure a healthy environment for all platform types.

An example of a game without pbmm is survival games (it does have pbmm but it’s never active, if u care to learn why hive has a thing on pbmm in their help page thing), which gets tops 300 players online at once (not good). SBMM would also just be annoying to people like me who are good on mobile, because instead of being rewarded for my skill by winning I’d just get matched with sweaty pc players instead.

SBMM is also just a bad system, try asking around in the pvp community why people don’t like bridge solos queue times and you’ll fairly soon find out why.

In conclusion, It seems that bridge’s sbmm has turned out terribly. I would much rather just have better platform-based matchmaking where it seperates people based on input type instead of just device type.

As a mobile player I don’t like being punished for being good by then getting matched with pc players. I’d rather just stay with a level playing field in terms of input type where skill is the only determining factor.

I thoroughly hope sbmm stays in bridge and doesn’t infect other gamemodes.

3 Likes
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My idea revolves around level based matchmaking and/or platform based matchmaking. Having it in other gamemodes, with improvements, would be better than just having it in bridge.

What I’m about to say may cause some backlash, but I do think that what I play on (nintendo switch) is genuinely harder to get good at than mobile. No offense whatsoever, but the sheer amount of bugs, and capabilities that the switch has are mediocre at best, whereas I almost always see smooth non-buggy performance on mobile, with some amount of control issues. The point I’m trying to make is that everything is flawed, and to overcome these flaws you need to adapt. I think what you say has merit, I just think there are pros and cons to both sides of the argument here.

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LOL
I have around 235 hive levels on my alt (switch) account and around 375 levels on my main (mobile) account, so I feel I’m qualified to make this statement: Switch gameplay is much smoother, easier, and more bug-free than mobile gameplay by a mile and a half. There are many aspects of switch play that are impossible to replicate correctly on the old (better) mobile controls, like jump bridging, projectile combos, and the ability to change perspective with a button. Switch players also are able to sprint midair and don’t have to deal with dpad glitch.
However, I think you are right. For pvp games mobile players should only be queueing with other mobile players to ensure fairness, and same for controller players such as yourself, you should only have to pvp against other controller players. For this reason sbmm is a terrible idea, as it would match mobile players with controller and pc players, which is inherently unfair.

You are aware that this is already in games, but it’s bugged and switch players still queue with mobile players, right? A simple, easy fix would be to make switch players queue with other console players instead.

There are both good mobile players and good switch players (amingpow comes to mind), so to say that is a bit misleading.

All in all, I think the easiest solution to the problem you described in your response to me is to have better pbmm (make sure switch players queue with other controller players instead of with mobile players).
And the easiest solution to your original post is to just an improvement to the anticheat and then get good.

1 Like
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This will literally happen to the other games if SBMM was considered in every PVP game. Sure you might be happy with this for a little bit but then as time goes on and you fight more sweaty players, you’ll get tired of it soon enough.

You do realize that cheaters can come in all levels right? Level doesn’t always mean skill just so you know.

I don’t think much people would play this tbh. Most people would rather play a normal game without any matchmaking.

I have no clue at all how this is possible but okay.

Treasure Wars is fine. I literally can’t stress enough how Treasure Wars doesn’t need SBMM and other matchmaking categories.

3 Likes
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Does that apply for switch lite?

Ok maybe i’m just bad, i can’t jump bridge for the life of me and projectile combos, or any type of combo really is a bit hard for me.

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I can only speak for the normal nintendo switch, I have never had the (mis?)fortune of playing on the switch lite

It takes some learning, I’d recommended going into a tw cs and just practicing the motions with a friend (if u need someone to do this with pm me i gotchu tho not over the next few days probably)

2 Likes
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Yeah switch lite does suck imo, but I would argue that they’re somewhat the same in terms of how bad it is to play on switch and mobile, but tbh we all probably biased a bit here

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Cheaters can come in all levels, but if you think about it a level 3 player who’s really good is probably either an alt or a cheater. It’s harder to tell when you’re a higher level due to the fact that everybody you face is somewhat good at the game.

I’m not saying that my concepts are good by any means, and why should they, I’m just some random guy who joined a few days ago, but it’s just a thought of mine.

I actually enjoy fighting sweaty players, since it requires me to actually try to play the game every now and then. Often I can’t beat them, but it does help me become better at the game and adapt.

To reply to what you said at the end of your post, I think Treasure Wars doesn’t specifically need this, I just gave an example, which happens to be the game I play the most.

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It’s entirely possible for someone who’s level 3 to just be really good. Low levels don’t mean someone isn’t skilled at the game, they probably have experience from other servers. There’s a lot of possibilities, which is what oblivion means by Level doesn’t always mean skill just so you know.

4 Likes
13

Please no. :cry:

I’m pretty sure Hive is planning to add SBMM to every game even though the majority of players hate it in Bridge. It makes the queue times way too long and doesn’t even work half the time. I am very much against SBMM and I trust Absurd to know what he’s talking about with PBMM being a better system.

1 Like