Add rule that disallows mini-modding

i have mixed feelings about this. On the one hand, people can spread misinformation and i certainly think that normal users shouldnt be able to say which packs are bannable or not. However, occasionally when im in hub and theres no helpers around, players ask questions. usually i answer these questions to the best of my ability, unless im not sure of course, in which case i say i dont know. some examples include ‘where did you get that costume/hubtitle’ or ‘what does X colour name mean’

thank you for coming to my tedtalk

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Yeah, I agree with @vPleebs on a lot of this. About the #bedrock-help-me, I’m probably one of the more active users in that channel on some days, and I do see a lot of people who give wrong information. Usually, they end up deleting their message, but this is only if I, or someone else, replies and says something different. Now for me, I only reply if I’m 95% sure on something. If I don’t know how to answer something, I usually just let it sit and let a staff member look at it. If no one answers them, I usually DM an online helper and ask, then DM the user who asked once I know the answer. Now it does sometimes feel like people are trying to help for “clout” sometimes. It always bugs me when someone says something wrong, but I usually try to leave it. Now here on the forums, I do think some cases of mini-modding are good. Like I don’t think replying to a suggestion/topic and saying it’s a duplicate and pinging a mod are bad. On the other hand, I don’t think people should be publicly replying to small cases of rule-breaking in topics, that’s a staff members’ job. If someone is breaking the rules/encouraging breaking the rules, I sometimes flag it as “other” and say that it promotes rule-breaking. I also sometimes just DM the user, but I try not to tell them to stop doing something, I usually advise against it, and say how it could get them in trouble. For example, when I see someone wearing a short skin in the hub, and there’s no other staff members there, I’d say, “Hey @xXSteveinsmashXx I might want to change your skin if I were you, because that skin is quite small and small skins are against the rules.” I don’t do this if there’s a staff member there, because that’s their job. The main point here being, don’t act like a staff member. You shouldn’t be telling others to stop doing something, you’re a community member, so maybe advise against it and explain how doing x thing is frowned upon. If you see something bad, use the tools you have as a member and try to help them. Don’t reply just to look big and tough, reply to help. That’s what our job is as a community.

Also, I do think that a lot of the “‘mini-modding,” if you can even call it that, is from immature/newer users. I don’t think that’s a scapegoat at all, it’s just the truth of it.

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The Hive have always welcomed the community to help. This will never change.
I try to help out on the Discord/Forums as much as I can, and throughout time, I have learnt a whole lot more than I once did. Helping, when I didn’t know much, has given me that practice and knowledge to help people much better and efficiently than I ever could before. It’s a learning curve.

You learn through experience, and that’s the beauty of it.

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You can’t learn things by testing things on people they are not guinea pigs or something. They might need a definite answer urgently and a wrong answer could leave them very confused or lead to more misinformation.

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Yeah I can definitely see where you are coming from, since a good portion of the helpers aren’t exactly the most active. If you answer questions that you know and don’t answer ones you don’t know stuff should turn out ok, it’s when people answer questions they don’t know where issues arise.

Also I’m glad helping people out has helped you out Orbi, I used to help out somewhat often on the hive discord, and I probably had my fair share of mistakes, however I wouldn’t state something as 100 percent fact unless I knew it was 100 percent fact. It seems barely anyone does this.

Minimodding isn’t pure evil or anything close to that, but I think the issues outweigh the benefits, and the hive should just not allow it since ultimately it should make the community better

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I was just trying to help, dang! :triumph:

And it freaking has 10 likes?!

it’s the way you said it, you were acting like you were a moderator

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Isn’t that how everyone talks here? :thinking:

And what’s wrong with me talking like a moderator?

not everyone*

dude, please rethink about what you’re about to say before saying it out loud

because you aren’t a mod and yet you are trying to act like one as if you had control of everything

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We all talk differently, and I like to help out on the forums, like don’t make it so complicated. We ask for help, we recieve help. I really don’t like the suggestion because first, report or tell them it’s wrong, don’t make it so complicated. Second, if it doesn’t say Hive Helper or Staff, how is it confusing? If staff comments and someone says something, heck, just take the staff’s advice! We all make mistakes and we learn from them. Bruh, my hand hurts so badly for writing this.

You did not read the thread because if you did, you would definitely know you were the one in the wrong.

Read

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My rule is help if you know, if you don’t, go.

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Everyone, just read post #30 or I will regret typing all of that…

And yeah @anon30869038, keeping it simple, not complicated lol.

Same here, and I think most people respect this rule, but there is also people who unfortunately don’t lol.

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I think adding “only answer questions if you’re sure about the answer & there aren’t any active helpers” to the channel description of bedrock-help-me, or a pinned message, would help with the issue of misinformation some.

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Definitely agree with that.

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Alright so to sum it up, i feel like most of us disagreeing here would be better with the rule/ statement that @BlazeDrake100 said instead of a rule about not mini-modding (aka helping people or warning them :D) although im not fully sure.

Props to everyone in about the first 25 replies having a great conversation! It’s rare to see those these days, and thanks to @iTGT7 for making a really nice post about the subject. We should all keep up the actually insightful convos :DD

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pinging the mods made it better what are you on about

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That just made it annoying for the mods funyn joeke doe

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I am going to contribute my two sense to this discussion as I have advocated for a regulation aganist intentional misinformation, or deception, for multiple months now. We ask ourselves if minimodding should be allowed? Minimodding from a literal definition, being “when a person acts as if they have moderator permissions or power to punish someone”, should be punishable in my opinion, but not for the reason argued in this thread. As many have mentioned, helping players is an essential part of every community. Volunteers do not have the time to answer every single question, especially on a server such as the Hive where the ratio between staff to concurrent players is nearly 1 to 250. I support the idea that player assistance is necessary. yet we often fail to consider how the gain of knowledge becomes obstructed.

I fully agree with @OnlyOrbixx in that helping others provides a necessary learning curve for yourself, however, what happens when there fails to be an assessment of the knowledge you are sharing? Knowledge relies on reasoning, intuition, and ultimately faith. Many children follow a blind faith, unfortunately, not stepping back and questioning the information they are provided. This is a danger is that knowledge they are being given goes unchecked, even if that misinformation comes from a reputable player people trust. I have witnessed players get two seperate answers from two seperate players, which causes the dilenma for the player of which to trust. The other week, the situation of two support staff saying two seperate answers, occurred, showing that sometimes even the staff make mistakes simply because we are all human, and we can all make mistakes. I do not believe that this should punishable however, as it usually is only an accident. I am more concerned about the intentional misinformation and deception, rather than misinformation itself.

I believe that should a rule aganist misinformation be implemented, it should be along the lines of “Do not intentionally mislead someone into believing an idea that is not factually supported or accurate”, with an emphasize on the “intentionally” wording. If someone is sharing misinformation that they believe is accurate, I do not think that should be punished and instead is room for a learning curve. When someone is purposely sharing misinformation, however, is when I believe it has gone too far.

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Image 1. Players tricking a new user into believing Ultimate is Admin on discord.

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Image 2. Continuation of the joke despite being clear the other does not know.

The example I mention in relation to this discussion is an event that occured on the discord several months ago. On 22 June 2020, multiple players were able to convince a new user that ultimate was admin, and the new user openly believed that ultimate was admin for several minutes. Several staff members participated in the joke, not realizing that KileyBelade was not aware it was a joke. I would like to state that I did contact Matt about this incidient in correlation to other details. Likely this has been discussed on the staff side, yet it failed to solve the issue of what caused it: intentional spread of misinformation. As far as I am aware, these players were never punished, although they were punished for other rule violations later. This is one example, and there have likely been more, however, I have drifted away from the Hive Discord and have not seen any.

At the end of the day, this is a decision for the administration to make and I assume they have discussed this idea before. What that exact decision was, we may never know.

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